One day a group of scientists got together and decided that man had come a long way and no longer needed God. So they picked one scientist to go and tell Him that they were done with Him. The scientist walked up to God and said, "God, we've decided that we no longer need you. We're to the point that we can clone people and do many miraculous things, so why don't you just go on and get lost."
God listened very patiently and kindly to the man and after the scientist was done talking, God said, "Very well, how about this, let's say we have a man making contest."
To which the scientist replied, "OK, great!"
But God added, "Now, we're going to do this just like I did back in the old days with Adam."
The scientist said, "Sure, no problem" and bent down and grabbed himself a handful of dirt.
God just looked at him and said, "No, no, no. You go get your own dirt!"
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This facetious joke makes a deep statement regarding the reality of our Universe. Whether you're a Christian, Atheist, Jew, Muslim, etc., there is an explanation that is required of your set of beliefs as to what/whom created the Universe. This applies to atheism as much as any religion of the world.
Indeed, the idea of a Universe ex nihilo continually undermines the development of any modern theory of organic differentiation. The controversy gets to the point where only two major premises can be rationally considered: 1) Our universe is eternal. If it is not eternal than it had to have a beginning (scientific research points to the fact that it did have a beginning). If it has a beginning than it must come from somewhere (have a cause). This source/cause must be eternal. If this source were not eternal then it had a beginning and you're right back where you started. If this cause is material (another universe or physical dimension) and it has existed for eternity as it must have, then the basic law of entropy would have been dwindling down the power of this source from eternity past leaving nothing to the modern observer in which to reside. Or (2)This source/cause is eternal, as indeed it must be, and immaterial. This places it in a realm outside of the effects of entropy and other physical laws. The source must be personal because it chooses to act (once there was was no Universe, now there is), and it must be exceedingly powerful and vast in order to create our exceedingly vast and powerful Universe.
A careful read of the second premise to an open-minded observer should cause those genuinely seeking for truth to reconsider a material theory for the problem of origins. It certainly makes room for an immaterial or 'spiritual' source. Perhaps this does not point to Yaweh or Allah specifically at this point of philosophical rhetoric, but you're certainly dwindling down the possibilities, as well as opening some new ones for the skeptical mind.
(Credit should be given to William Lane Craig as the words are mine, but the ideas were taught to me by him.)
5/4/08
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11 comments:
Wrestling with issues such as this are common among science lectures and science classroom settings. It seems that evolution has a monopoly on the science curriculum and this alternate theory is never presented. Although the issues faced in this particular post are addressed from a philosophical standpoint, not a scientific one, except for the mention of the law of entropy, it is an issue debated among open-minded scientists constantly.
As Christians we tend to accept what is fed from the pulpit without learning for ourselves. We tend to eat and digest words from a pastor rather than seeking out answers on our own time. I am not saying that pastors do not or cannot explain or elucidate the issues of the origin of life eloquently and in a scientific way, I am just placing the issue on the table that we must learn how to learn for ourselves. I was elated to see this post by Mr. Remy placed on this blog.
It does address a very serious issue. Who created or what created our universe? I am not going to place arguments or viewpoints up here like other writers have done because I am not a scholar to do so. I just wanted to show my appreciation for addressing this topic and I hope to read other writers' discussion on this issue.
Erick
"In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth" Genesis 1:1.
That settles it for me...
After committing my life to Christ I made one more life altering decision: to take the Word of God as inerrant by faith. Having been a staunch evolutionist I clearly understood from a reading of God's Word that there would be little hope in combining my previous scientific training and the truths that I read in God's Word without greatly altering the ideas that each one teaches. This issue brought a strong turmoil to my mind. But I reacted like Jorge clearly put it: '"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth" Genesis 1:1.
That settles it for me...'
And even after I had made that decision the Lord was merciful and led me to different people and material that encouraged me to view the evidence found in nature that points to God. (Romans 1:20)
Though I had made a decision by faith that I would trust God's Word, I inherently sensed that if God says He created the Universe then true scientific endeavors should complement this. Many great Christian scientists like Isaac Newton and Louis Pasteur concurred with this.
I think it's primarily important to stand on a foundation of faith in God's Word, but to not pursue scholarly research only does a diservice to the hundreds of thousands of youths whose faith is being slaughtered in public schools and college campuses, particularly in the United States. This is a directed attack specifically against Christianity, though all faiths are included.
I saw the obvious problem: The Word of God says one thing, but my science teacher says another. Which is it? Both cases require faith. Do I trust my science teacher or do I trust the Word of God? The work of the Holy Spirit in me leads me to choose the Word of God, but then what do I do about what my science teacher says? Unfortunately, not all youth make the proper decision, and there are countless young people that are shaken and destroyed by the effect that their secular schooling had on them. Let those that are called in the body of Christ equip them for the work of the ministry (Ephesians 4:12) and help them "give a defense to everyone who asks you a reason for the hope that is in you, with meekness and fear;: (I Peter 3:15)
We can also flip the perspective. How many youth have I heard praising God when they see that scientific research only reiterates the truth of God's Power and Majesty? How many times have I been awed and grateful to the Lord for mercifully showing me that the universe and its laws are indeed governed by Him? Colossians 1:15-17 "He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For by Him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by Him and for Him. He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together." It has done nothing but strengthen my faith and widen my appreciation and awe of my Daddy.
Some don't need this kind of confirmation. Some do. The Bible is not a scientific textbook. And it's difficult to determine what's 'true' research and what isn't. But some people take apologetics courses to defend their faith philosophically. Not because God needs defending, and not because God needs someone to help persuade people into accepting Christ as if they were a car salesman. Apologetics, like Ravi Zacharias says: helps to remove the obstacles that keep people from looking directly at the cross of Christ.
In this, let us include 'scientific' apologetics as well.
Thank you erick and Jorge for your comments. Both of your statements were candid and true.
By the way, the main post on which this conversation is based was originally a comment I made on a blog about an article that discusses how birds can visualize magnetic fields. Feel free to check out some of the comments made by some other individuals on this blog. It's interesting to see how the topic of focus shifted from the article tremendously. It seems also as if the unbelievers were the ones to bring up the subject of Creation. There were some interesting comments and replies made to my post as well that I found intriguing since it seems that some come from nonChristian perspectives.
Here's the link
http://www.dailygalaxy.com/my_weblog/2008/05/birds-quantum-m.html#more
Remy, I totally agree that we must equip the young people that are coming to the Lord to be able to contend for the faith. I believe that the best way to do that is by establishing relationships and mentoring, and by keeping things simple. After all the Gospel message is the simplest message that we can teach.
I think these verses go along with what you're saying Berny:
Hebrews 5:12 - 6:3
"For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the first principles of the oracles of God; and you have come to need milk and not solid food. For everyone who partakes only of milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, for he is a babe. But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, that is, those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil. Therefore let us leave the elementary teachings about Christ and go on to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from acts that lead to death, and of faith in God, instruction about baptisms, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. And God permitting, we will do so."
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By the waym thank you for sharing the DVD offer. I have seen the two DVDs on intelligent design a couple of times already. They are excellent in terms of pointing to evidence of God's involvement in Creation. Perhaps I can get my school to buy them.
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Remy.
God bless you all.
P.S. Let's keep Freddy and Nana in our prayers! Nana is expected to deliver their baby in a couple hours!
I think what you guys discuss on this blog and the different posts are incredible. I learn a lot just by reading them and many times I rethink what I believe and actually study it rather than digesting everything thrown at me without question. I just had an idea about someone posting a section where its not a predetermined topic but one where people can ask questions. It was just a thought...
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